Religion / End Times

Topics related to theology.
Cool Breeze
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Re: Religion / End Times

Post by Cool Breeze »

Tom Mazanec wrote:
Tue Oct 26, 2021 8:39 am
Nations that do not allow Freedom of Religion in 2021 are (predominantly) Red China and the Muslim world.
So you think the West is destined to win WWIII?
There are many christians in those lands, though, already. This confirms the period I cited, and supports what I have stated.

As I have stated before, if you read the holy fathers you'll see that nearly everything speculated on in may of these religious topics has already come up in prior ages and been debunked as heresy.

John
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Re: Religion / End Times

Post by John »

** 26-Oct-2021 World View: End Times in Buddhism, Christianity and Shia Islam

The "End Times" theology is crucially important to
any religion. The reason is simple: A religion can't solve
people's problems today any more than a government can.
A religion can't solve poverty, street crime, marital problems, or
anything else. Just like a government, a religion can only tax
people, line their own pockets, and perhaps spend a little money
to help actual people.

So this means that nobody will actually join a religion voluntarily,
because the religion has nothing to offer. That's where "end times"
comes in. "If you join our religion, we'll screw you just like the
government, we'll get you to fight in our wars and perhaps get killed
(or martyred), and in return we'll promise you a reward in the next
life, when we won't even be around, so we won't even have to listen to
you whine."

The Chinese made a science out of using the afterlife to manipulate
people. Confucianism has been a disaster. The leader has a Mandate
from Heaven until something goes wrong, so when something goes wrong
the leader has to use violence against his oven people to keep them
in line. Buddhism spread in China because it promised an afterlife
in which the leader would be better off than the governing leader.

In my Vietnam book, I wrote brief summaries of the "end times"
in Buddhism, Christianity and Shia Islam:

John Xenakis is author of: "World View: Vietnam, Buddhism, and the Vietnam War:
How Vietnam became an economic powerhouse after the Vietnam War"
(Generational Theory Book Series, Book 4), March 2021
Paperback: 325 pages, over 200 source references, $13.99
http://www.generationaldynamics.com/pg/ ... s.vnbk.htm
https://www.amazon.com/World-View-Buddh ... 732738645/

The following are excerpts from my Vietnam book:

**** Bodhisattvas in Mahayana Buddhism

The goal of every practitioner of Mahayana Buddhism is to escape the
endless cycle of birth, death and rebirth by becoming enlightened and
achieving Nirvana. However, some people, Bodhisattvas, achieve
enlightenment but choose to delay entering Nirvana by remaining in the
world to ensure the ultimate salvation of all sentient beings.
Compassion is much more than sympathy and extends even to giving one's
own life to save another. A bodhisattva actively helps others, sharing
intuitive wisdom, understanding, and strength with all those who are
seeking enlightenment.

In Sanskrit, the word “bodhisattva” is a compound word formed from
bodhi (spiritual awakening, enlightenment) and sattva (a being,
essence, spirit). The word can then be translated as “A being set
upon enlightenment,” “One whose essence is perfect knowledge,” or “A
being whose essence is enlightenment.”

In early Buddhism, bodhisattva meant “the previous lives of a (or the)
Buddha.” In Mahayana Buddhism, bodhisattva refers to a human being
committed to the attainment of enlightenment for the sake of
others. Becoming a bodhisattva is the goal of Mahayana Buddhism. By
introducing new Bodhisattvas, Mahayana Buddhism vastly increased the
range of objects of devotion for practitioners.

**** The Maitreya in Buddhism

There is a small part of Buddhist theology that is interesting to
Westerners because of its similarity to millennial beliefs in
Christianity and Shia Islam.

The Maitreya is the "future Buddha" in Buddhist theology, who many
Buddhists believe will eventually appear on earth, achieve complete
enlightenment, and teach the pure dharma. As such, he will be the
spiritual successor of the historic Buddha, and he is predicted to be
a "world ruler," uniting those over whom he has dominion.

The Maitreya represents the millennial aspirations of the vast
majority of the world's Buddhists, regardless of their particular
doctrinal orientations. It is thought that Maitreya’s coming will
occur after the current Buddha's teachings (the Dharma) are completely
forgotten and the world is left in a moral vacuum. At this time, the
enlightened Maitreya will descend from heaven and be reincarnated as a
human child.

The Maitreya belief in Buddhism is roughly equivalent to the Christian
belief in the second coming of Christ, or the Shia Muslim belief that
the "Hidden Imam" is going to return as the messiah to avenge
injustices to the Shia Muslim people.

Another similarity is that just as Christian cultists have at numerous
times predicted that the "second coming" was imminent, there have also
been Maitreya cultists, but in this case claiming to be the Maitreya
himself. One of the most well-known in modern times was L. Ron
Hubbard (1911 – 1986), founder of Dianetics and Scientology, who
suggested in a 1955 poem that he had the characteristics of the coming
Maitreya.

In China, a number of anti-government rebellions were led by someone
claiming to be the Maitreya. One of the most prominent was the 1351
Red Turban Rebellion (also known as the First White Lotus
Rebellion). Han Shantong, the leader of the White Lotus Society,
rebelled against the Mongol masters of the Yuan Dynasty. Shantong's
anti-Mongol slogan was "The empire is in utter chaos. Maitreya Buddha
has incarnated, and the Manichaean King of Light has appeared in this
world."

Navigator
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Re: Religion / End Times

Post by Navigator »

I think a main issue here is the purpose of religion.

I concur with you that many religions have been used to subjugate people or to specific political ends. The Dark Ages are probably the best example.

Religions used to political ends (thus a sign that they are false) are those that (one or many may apply):
Force adherence to their beliefs on penalty of death.
Allow you a "free pass" for sin, not through repentance, but through death in battle.
Advocate the death of non-adherents.
Do not tolerate the expression of ideas or practices not sanctioned by them.

I believe that everyone is exercising Free Agency, meaning that God has given each of us the freedom to chose. We can chose to do what is right or what is wrong. So long as some people chose to do wrong, there are going to be problems (like poverty, crime, and marital problems). And I believe that God is never going to force someone to chose right.

But God is not indifferent to what is going on. There are consequences for choices and for actions. I believe that God loves his children, so much so that he provides for them a way to receive mercy and thus avoid the consequences. This is through repentance and faith in Christ, who suffered for our sins (so we don't have to). But even this repentance process is Voluntary. No one is forced.

People who do bad things and don't repent are therefore responsible themselves for what they have done, and will ultimately suffer the consequences. This is not necessarily a mortal consequence, but there definitely will be an eternal one.

In the history of this world, there will be a time when God says, "Enough". This is what I believe is foretold in scriptures. The world becomes evil enough that he ends its current course of existence, allowing only those who strive to be good to survive.

According to the Bible he has done something similar before.

The promise this time is that when he does so, that Christ will return and reign as King on Earth, and that the people that are born and live under his reign (until the end of this thousand year period) are those that God knows will strive to be good.

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Tom Mazanec
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Re: Religion / End Times

Post by Tom Mazanec »

"Order of magnitude" technically means power of ten. So you think hundreds of millions of casualties, not tens of millions nor thousands of millions, right?
“Hard times create strong men. Strong men create good times. Good times create weak men. And, weak men create hard times.”

― G. Michael Hopf, Those Who Remain

Navigator
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Casualties

Post by Navigator »

World War One Casualties (military and civilian) were around 40 million dead.

World War Two Casualties (military and civilian) were around 80 million dead. Of these, maybe 20 million were due to famine/starvation.

I think it is entirely conceivable that WW3 could result in 400-800 million dead, or even more. Especially given what is going to happen to global food supply chains, which are now much more complex than 80-100 years ago (WW1-WW2 time period). Famine and starvation could cause deaths that equal or exceed deaths caused by military operations.

Cool Breeze
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Re: Religion / End Times

Post by Cool Breeze »

Navigator wrote:
Tue Oct 26, 2021 10:40 pm
Religions used to political ends (thus a sign that they are false) are those that (one or many may apply):
Force adherence to their beliefs on penalty of death.
Allow you a "free pass" for sin, not through repentance, but through death in battle.
Advocate the death of non-adherents.
Do not tolerate the expression of ideas or practices not sanctioned by them.
This is the exact framework of Islam, yet people like John call me a bigot for pointing it out.
I believe that everyone is exercising Free Agency, meaning that God has given each of us the freedom to chose. We can chose to do what is right or what is wrong. So long as some people chose to do wrong, there are going to be problems (like poverty, crime, and marital problems). And I believe that God is never going to force someone to chose right.
Correct.
People who do bad things and don't repent are therefore responsible themselves for what they have done, and will ultimately suffer the consequences. This is not necessarily a mortal consequence, but there definitely will be an eternal one.
Right again.
In the history of this world, there will be a time when God says, "Enough". This is what I believe is foretold in scriptures. The world becomes evil enough that he ends its current course of existence, allowing only those who strive to be good to survive.

According to the Bible he has done something similar before.
Yes, the flood, indeed. To destroy evil and demonic creatures. Which raises the question regarding transhumanism attempts at being the next type of Nephilim.
The promise this time is that when he does so, that Christ will return and reign as King on Earth, and that the people that are born and live under his reign (until the end of this thousand year period) are those that God knows will strive to be good.
There is no basis for this. The Creed says he will judge the living and the dead, and his kingdom will have no end. Just reminding you that people closer to the source, more knowledgeable, and holier than you and me already stated what the belief is. They were the same church of the creed, also mentioned, which is "one, holy catholic and apostolic." And no, not what is called "roman catholic" today.

Navigator
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Re: Religion / End Times

Post by Navigator »

There are a number of prophetic writings in the bible that deal with the "End Times".

Obviously, Revelations is the most famous. But it is also written about in Matthew, alluded to frequently in the letters of the Apostles.

It is also prominent in Daniel and of course Isaiah.

Isaiah's writings are very difficult to understand, but they are very insightful, especially if you have the assistance of a Hebrew scholar.

Here is a link to the best analysis of Isaiah I have ever read.
https://www.isaiahexplained.com/1#commentary

Note the video vignette links to the upper right hand side of the page. These are very good too.

Isaiah uses the events of his day to talk about not only what was happening around him, but also to provide allusion/example to our day.

Which, as we frequently talk about here, is a replay of many of the things he was seeing first hand earlier in history.

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Bob Butler
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Re: Religion / End Times

Post by Bob Butler »

Navigator wrote:
Tue Oct 26, 2021 10:40 pm
I think a main issue here is the purpose of religion.

I concur with you that many religions have been used to subjugate people or to specific political ends. The Dark Ages are probably the best example.

Religions used to political ends (thus a sign that they are false) are those that (one or many may apply):
Force adherence to their beliefs on penalty of death.
Allow you a "free pass" for sin, not through repentance, but through death in battle.
Advocate the death of non-adherents.
Do not tolerate the expression of ideas or practices not sanctioned by them.
It is almost as if religion has two purposes. One can use it to strive to be a better person and to live in a better society. Alternatively, you can use it to amass wealth, influence, military force or other things literally of this world. John X outlined one way an end times doctrine can be used for temporal power. Others here are more generally searching for enlightenment or truth.

Generally most religious organizations have been abusive and temporal at one time or another. Generally, many religious people are striving for some positive ideal.

I’m quite skeptical of those amassing wealth, power, or military might. I am very suspicious of those who engage in tribal thinking, encouraging a sense of superiority, prejudice, oppression and violence.

Navigator
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Good vs Evil

Post by Navigator »

It is if there are two basic religions. One is good, and is voluntary.

The other is evil, and uses Force.

This is the main point on my website: https://www.comingstorms.com

I also discussed this in the other topic, under religion/theology.

FullMoon
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Re: Religion / End Times

Post by FullMoon »

Since this is about end times, is there any scriptural reference to what is being done to the children now. I see it as something like a sacrifice of the next generation. As a parent that is something of my perspective. And it seems biblical on it's scope

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