Generational Dynamics World View News

Post a reply


This question is a means of preventing automated form submissions by spambots.
Smilies
:D :) ;) :( :o :shock: :? 8-) :lol: :x :P :oops: :cry: :evil: :twisted: :roll: :!: :?: :idea: :arrow: :| :mrgreen: :geek: :ugeek:

BBCode is ON
[img] is ON
[url] is ON
Smilies are ON

Topic review
   

Expand view Topic review: Generational Dynamics World View News

Re: Generational Dynamics World View News

by tim » Sun Jun 22, 2025 9:48 am

I don't suspect China is going to attack Taiwan only be to drawn into another slow grind like Russia in Ukraine with the U.S.

The coming Chinese surprise attack on America might be a missile attack, drone attack, or something from space.
Secondary criteria indicating a crisis war

The following are secondary criteria that identify crisis wars:

Secret mobilization. Example: Germany in 1930s. A country that mobilizes for war in secret is usually preparing to strike first in a crisis war. Why? Because secret mobilization requires the cooperation of a great deal of the public, and indicates very broad support for the impending war.
Surprise attack on enemy. Related to the previous point is that a surprise attack on an adversary usually indicates a crisis war.

"Spiraling out of control". Examples: Rwanda, 1994; French Revolution Reign of Terror, 1792. If a war, especially a civil war, seems to spring from nowhere, it almost always indicates widespread public desire for war and vengeance.

Refusal to surrender. Example: Germany 1944. If a nation continues fighting even when defeat is clearly unavoidable, it's most likely a crisis war.
The secondary criteria alone do not indicate a crisis war. For example, some non-crisis wars are surprise attacks.

Re: The US has bombed Iran.

by tim » Sun Jun 22, 2025 9:44 am

DaKardii wrote: Sat Jun 21, 2025 10:40 pmNow what?
https://www.generationaldynamics.com/pg ... tmodel.htm
Criteria indicating crisis war

A crisis war is like a ball rolling downhill, usually over a period 5-10 years long. It may (or may not) need a push to start, and it may be temporary stopped by obstacles on the way down. But eventually it starts gathering an enormous amount of energy, and at some point its momentum becomes so great that it's unstoppable, until it reaches the bottom of the hill in an explosive climax that forever changes the landscape.

The rolling ball analogy can be used only so far, but it represents something real: A steadily increasing anxiety on the part of the people fighting the war, an increasing hatred of the enemy, an increasing desire for genocidal vengeance, and a willingness to risk everything for total victory.

To understand the emotion behind a crisis war, you have to think about wars where this kind of energy was displayed: Think of the early 1990s Balkans, where the Serbs pursued massive ethnic cleansing (mass murdering the men, mass raping the women) of the Croats and the Bosnians; think of the 1994 Rwanda war, where Hutus murdered and dismembered a million Tutsis in a three month period; think of President Truman's vengeful statement after a nuclear weapon had destroyed a Japanese city; think of the mass murder and mass destruction of an entire region when General Sherman marched his troops through Georgia near the end of the Civil War.

A crisis war may start out small, but it builds in strength and energy until it becomes as unstoppable a force of nature as a raging typhoon.

In another chapter (where?) we quoted at length Leo Tolstoy's discussion, in War and Peace of the Battle of Borodino, and in particular the fact that Napoleon could not have stopped the battle: "Had Napoleon then forbidden them to fight the Russians, they would have killed him and have proceeded to fight the Russians because it was inevitable."

This is the essence of a crisis war. A huge mass of people who are willing to kill or be killed. An unstoppable "ball of invasion," in Tolstoy's words.

So to understand a crisis war, we really need to understand people's feelings and intentions. This is something that the TFT authors were able to measure by reading contemporary diaries and histories.

We required a set of criteria that can evaluate a war based on commonly available facts about the war in ordinary history books, and the criteria should be as free of subjectivity as possible.

Unfortunately, there are no simple numeric measures that can be applied. In particular, the number of battle deaths does not seem to be an appropriate measure. World War I (in Western Europe) showed that it's possible to have a static non-crisis war and still have quite a few war deaths. The American Civil War, the worst war in United States history, killed 0.8% of the population. On the other hand, China's Taiping Rebellion civil war killed almost 15% of the population.

So we need to be able to measure the feelings and intentions of large masses of people, but without using simple numeric measures.

Since we can't measure public attitudes during historical wars, we look for "clues" in the historical descriptions of the wars to see if the criteria for a crisis war are met. If the clues are ambiguous, then it's necessary to refer to additional sources to get more information. In my experience, it's rare that an ambiguous situation remains ambiguous for long. Whether a war is a crisis war becomes abundantly clear very quickly.

Re: Generational Dynamics World View News

by tim » Sun Jun 22, 2025 9:41 am

The above article I posted showing how the younger generation in Iran is not uniting around their government during this war shows the difference between a country in an awakening era vs a crisis era.

In a crisis era, such as after the attack at Pearl Harbor or even the terrorist attacks on 9/11, you would not see a division in the younger generation where younger Americans would be voicing support for the Japanese to "hurry up and finish the job they started" or support for terrorism after 9/11.

Re: The US has bombed Iran.

by FullMoon » Sat Jun 21, 2025 11:29 pm

DaKardii wrote: Sat Jun 21, 2025 10:40 pmNow what?
Now we enter dangerous times.
Get what you need from shopping and secure your situation. Now we're exiting the eye of the storm. Good luck to you and everyone else!

The US has bombed Iran.

by DaKardii » Sat Jun 21, 2025 10:40 pm

Now what?

Re: Generational Dynamics World View News

by tim » Sat Jun 21, 2025 5:55 am

Navigator wrote: Fri Jun 13, 2025 2:14 pm However, when a foreign country (Israel) bombs your country (Iran), the response is generally increased support for the local regime. This means that Iranians, out of their own national pride, will, at least in the short term, most likely rally to the flag of the Ayatollahs.
https://www.bbc.com/news/articles/clyn2nv21q9o
'A choice of two evils': Young anti-regime Iranians divided over conflict
We have managed to speak to several young Iranians who oppose the regime - and have protested against it in the past - in recent days, however.

Their names have been changed for their safety as the Iranian authorities frequently imprison opponents in an attempt to suppress dissent.

Tara, 26, told the BBC that when Israel issues evacuation warnings ahead of strikes, authorities shut off internet access "so that people don't find out and the death toll rises".

Checkpoints and toll stations are also set up, she says, accusing authorities of "deliberately" creating traffic, which "encourages people to stay in targeted areas".

"Talking about patriotism, unity, and standing up to the enemy is absurd. The enemy has been killing us slowly for decades. The enemy is the Islamic Republic!"
Sima, 27, tells us she does not care about this anymore.

"I wish Israel would get the job done as soon as possible. I'm exhausted. Although I'm still not a fan of Israel or what it's doing, I hope they'd finish what they've started.

"Wishful thinking, I know. But I want them to rid us and the world of the threat of the IRGC [Islamic Revolutionary Guard Corps], [Ayatollah Ali] Khamenei and ayatollahs as a whole."
Some people we spoke to were even more forceful in their support for Israel's attacks.

Amir, 23, said he supported them "100%". Asked why, he said he believed no-one else was prepared to take on the regime.

"Not the UN, not Europe, not even us. We tried, remember? And they killed us in the streets. I'm joyful when the people who've crushed our lives finally taste fear. We deserve that much."

Amir is referencing the widespread protests in Iran following the death of Masha Amini. The 22-year-old died in police custody in 2022 after being arrested for allegedly violating rules requiring women to wear the headscarf.

Re: Generational Dynamics World View News

by FullMoon » Wed Jun 18, 2025 12:25 pm

https://www.reuters.com/world/middle-ea ... 025-06-17/

Speaking to reporters outside the White House, Trump declined to say whether he had made any decision on whether to join Israel's bombing campaign against arch-enemy Iran.

"I may do it. I may not do it. I mean, nobody knows what I'm going to do," he said

If the "bad guys " are ruled by unpredictable dictators who use Force to get their way, ummm, yeah. Trump thinks he's good at bluffing by acting tough or is he really an insane psychopath who doesn't even know what he himself will do. Isn't his finger on the nuclear button? No wonder they had to shepard him so closely during his last administration. And now he's a senile and confused person not much better than Biden. Any religion that needs violence to get a desired result is not a good religion, obviously. And now they each want violence for their expected outcome. The devil is having a field day.

Re: Generational Dynamics World View News

by FullMoon » Wed Jun 18, 2025 11:09 am

We don't need to review the list of attempts at American "regime change" and the ratio of success vs failure.

100% failure rate and that's even when somewhat qualified and capable personnel were involved.

Now we have both unqualified, unproven and incapable liars who have agendas that are not what they tell the country.

I wonder if anyone who served in previous failures conducted by lying politicians and were disabled, experienced the death of fellow soldiers and experienced the horror of war whilst the leaders who sent them were enriched and completely without recourse or accountability. I wonder if they regret supporting what's belatedly known to be a lie resulting in death and national degradation, but at the time seemed the "thing" to do. I wonder if they could be tricked once again, this time.

John was always so depressed because human beings had such pitiful lack of ability to correctly understand the mistakes of history and such strong emotive drive towards violence and war. The "fog" of war requires building a fear and hate feeling so that mass murder is considered acceptable.

Re: Generational Dynamics World View News

by tim » Wed Jun 18, 2025 8:22 am

https://x.com/CollinRugg/status/1935054120567848996
Collin Rugg

@CollinRugg
NEW: Exiled crown prince of Iran Reza Pahlavi says the Islamic Republic has "come to an end," says what has begun is irreversible.

Pahlavi ripped Supreme Leader Ali Khamenei for hiding like a "scared mouse."

"The Islamic Republic has come to an end and is falling. What has begun is irreversible. The future is bright and together we will navigate this sharp turn in history. Now is the time to stand; it is time to take back Iran. May I be with you soon."

Information Age Crisis?

by Bob Butler » Tue Jun 17, 2025 9:45 pm

FullMoon wrote: Tue Jun 17, 2025 7:18 pm Life as normal became war life as normal. They were lucky to emerge into a better world. We don't necessarily think that's a high probability.
Yes, few indeed remember the last Industrial Age crisis. But you still have to remember that none have lived through an Information Age crisis. Nukes make all out war not cost effective, so the autocrats are tippy toeing. Putin is teetering on the edge of losing his war and his status. China has impossible economic problems that make a sea war with the US seem feasible. Trump is in the process of creating our own economic collapse to rival the others. The Middle East is being the Middle East. The Jews have embraced racist genocide, which was the whole excuse for conquest of Muslim land in the first place. The Muslims haven’t the gumption for revolution against their autocrats.

Fourth Turning crisis theory put together a pretty good idea of how things flowed during the Information Age. Autocrats thought their military cultures could impose on industrial cultures and found they were wrong. (Napoleon and Hitler are the classic examples.) That lesson may or may not hold this time around. What is newer is that the economic collapse(s) are happening all around. (Trump, Xi, Putin.). Going to war during an economic collapse will be the new thing. Last time, war was the way out of the economic collapse. While I don’t see an invasion of the US across the Atlantic or Pacific, continuing the other conflicts may seem necessary for various autocrats to cling to power. One possibility is an EMP burst, a high altitude nuke knocking out considerable electronic and power infrastructure, making the economic collapses even worse.

But we are definitely treading new ground. The best resolution would be deciding that racism and conquest are counterproductive. I’m not holding my breath. You have to prove the theories wrong before you get rid of them.

Top