Generational Dynamics World View News

Discussion of Web Log and Analysis topics from the Generational Dynamics web site.
spottybrowncow
Posts: 317
Joined: Fri Jul 24, 2020 11:06 am

Re: Generational Dynamics World View News

Post by spottybrowncow »

Cool Breeze wrote:
Tue Jan 26, 2021 2:23 pm
It seems that Navi didn't even get that "passing laws" that are unconstitutional on their face, and subsequently obeying them, is NOT what an American would do. As we have already reached this point in many ways, each man has to decide for himself what to do, what risk and what gain he might have.

The idea that you are "holding America together" or "making good on the social contract" at this point by listening or bring obedient to leaders who hate our Constitution, is silly.
Not to speak for Navigator, but I think that he understands perfectly well. What guards at Nazi death camps did was likely legal based on the country's laws at that time, but I don't think anyone would now fault someone who disobeyed. Soldiers have a duty to disobey "illegal" orders, but that line has, I believe, historically been blurry. History would undoubtedly record George Washington's army as a bunch of traitors if they had lost. Given that the appropriateness of these type actions is often determined only in retrospect, drawing lines in the sand in advance probably serves no constructive purpose.

Navigator
Posts: 901
Joined: Wed Feb 06, 2019 2:15 pm

Re: Generational Dynamics World View News

Post by Navigator »

Now, having said all of that, lets get at what I actually wrote concerning Gun ownership:

1. No confiscation. What you have now is yours.
2. Need to certify that you can safely operate the weapon you want to buy before you get to buy it.
3. Stricter and more complete background checks.
4. Allowing the State, not Federal Government, to do most firearms regulations.

And, by the way, we already have gun control, it is called the National Firearms Act of 1934. It was passed to seriously restrict the ownership of fully automatic weapons (think the gangsters with Thompson submachine guns during prohibition). Almost everyone today believes this is reasonable. Here are some things that even I might be tempted to get if this was not extremely difficult:

An M2 .50 cal Machine Gun
A 60mm (better yet an 81mm) mortar
A 40mm grenade launcher for my AR-15
An Automatic grenade launcher
A 75mm Pack Howitzer

I know how to use each of these, and can do so safely, yet I am perfectly fine with knowing that I cannot buy one of these things for my own personal use, as almost no-one else can either.

John
Posts: 11478
Joined: Sat Sep 20, 2008 12:10 pm
Location: Cambridge, MA USA
Contact:

Re: Generational Dynamics World View News

Post by John »

** 26-Jan-2021 World View: Illegal actions
spottybrowncow wrote:
Tue Jan 26, 2021 5:02 pm
> Not to speak for Navigator, but I think that he understands
> perfectly well. What guards at Nazi death camps did was likely
> legal based on the country's laws at that time, but I don't think
> anyone would now fault someone who disobeyed. Soldiers have a duty
> to disobey "illegal" orders, but that line has, I believe,
> historically been blurry. History would undoubtedly record George
> Washington's army as a bunch of traitors if they had lost. Given
> that the appropriateness of these type actions is often determined
> only in retrospect, drawing lines in the sand in advance probably
> serves no constructive purpose.
Last year, antifa-blm fascists were burning down cities across the
country. Kamala Harris and AOC praised these fascist acts as "social
justice." This was the exact analogue to the Nazi Kristallnacht.

The point I'm making is that I'm challenging both you and Navi in the
sense that in the current evironment, there is no law. If you
criticize media censorship then you're a criminal because, by twisted
reasoning, you're advocating criminal behavior. But if you advocate
censorship, then you're indirectly approving of antifa-blm fascist
violence, which means that you're a hero supporting "social justice,"
not a criminal.

There was a time, not so long ago, when such insanity did not prevail
in America. But it does today. And it's getting progressively worse,
every day, as symbolized by the March of the Penguins.

** 12-Jan-21 World View -- America and the standard Genocide Playbook
** http://www.generationaldynamics.com/pg/ ... tm#e210112

Navigator
Posts: 901
Joined: Wed Feb 06, 2019 2:15 pm

Re: Generational Dynamics World View News

Post by Navigator »

John wrote:
Tue Jan 26, 2021 5:17 pm

Last year, antifa-blm fascists were burning down cities across the
country. Kamala Harris and AOC praised these fascist acts as "social
justice." This was the exact analogue to the Nazi Kristallnacht.

The point I'm making is that I'm challenging both you and Navi in the
sense that in the current evironment, there is no law. If you
criticize media censorship then you're a criminal because, by twisted
reasoning, you're advocating criminal behavior. But if you advocate
censorship, then you're indirectly approving of antifa-blm fascist
violence, which means that you're a hero supporting "social justice,"
not a criminal.

There was a time, not so long ago, when such insanity did not prevail
in America. But it does today. And it's getting progressively worse,
every day, as symbolized by the March of the Penguins.
Rioting and causing damage, looting, burning, smashing windows is all in fact illegal. Leaders praising such things are advocating what is actually illegal. And it is dead wrong.

There is still, for the most part, the rule of law. When government leaders decide NOT to enforce the law, things just go from extremely bad to worse (think DeBlasio and what is going on in NYC, or those in charge in Portland).

I don't think that criticizing media censorship is illegal, at least not last time I checked. It may get you blackballed, but not arrested. Still, there should be NO penalties for expressing your opinion, so long as you are not advocating violence. And advocating violence is actually illegal.

Most of the problems you are talking about are due to the hypocrisy of many on the Left (or extreme Right). They are OK with flagrant law breaking, so long as it appears to promote their viewpoint or cause. But if it doesn't, THEN they will come after you with the full force of the law.

This Hypocrisy is long standing with the Left. Republicans in Nixon's time were ready to convict him in the Senate. What he did was wrong/illegal and he was about to suffer the consequences (Justice applies to all - the fundamental conservative value) when he resigned. Democrats in Clinton's time would not convict him in the Senate because his political views were the same as theirs, even though he was guilty of Perjury, Witness Tampering, Sexual Harassment, and probably guilty of Rape.

User avatar
Bob Butler
Posts: 1462
Joined: Wed Jun 10, 2020 9:48 am
Location: East of the moon, west of the sun
Contact:

Re: Generational Dynamics World View News

Post by Bob Butler »

John wrote:
Tue Jan 26, 2021 5:17 pm
Last year, antifa-blm fascists were burning down cities across the country. Kamala Harris and AOC praised these fascist acts as "social justice." This was the exact analogue to the Nazi Kristallnacht.
You regularly attribute the violence last summer to Antifa and Black Lives matter. I think Black Lives Matter are practicing non violence along the pattern set by Gandhi and King. Protest enough and someone figures out that they can win votes by listening. The violence comes from folks like the bad cops, the looters, the Boogaloo Bois, the Proud Boys, QAnon and the secret police. The Wolverine Watchmen are not included only as the cops acted before their plans went into effect. This violence came to a head, became a crisis level problem, with the capitol insurrection.

As long as you maintain this misattribution, this lack of understanding of what is happening, you end up fighting the wrong enemy.

I am more inclined to associate the Nazi Kristallnacht with the capitol riots. Both were attempts by authoritarians to overthrow a legitimate democratic government. The difference was that the capitol insurrection didn’t work.

Navigator
Posts: 901
Joined: Wed Feb 06, 2019 2:15 pm

Re: Generational Dynamics World View News

Post by Navigator »

The problems we have had of late are just a repeat of what happened in 2016.

The first presidential candidate I can recall calling the presidential election "invalid" was Hillary Clinton. She refused to accept that Trump had actually been elected. Instead she blamed the results on "Russian Interference" and that Trump was in collusion with the Russians to fix the election. (OK, there was the 2000 hanging chad bit, but that situation was resolved civilly though there were longstanding hard feelings).

Hillary had people try to intimidate electoral college electors. There were riots in the streets in many cities, for quite some time. They just weren't smart enough to think of storming the Capitol during the electoral college certification process or they may well have done that too.

So now Trump follows basically the same courses of action, with the added weight that he is the incumbent (and Commander in Chief). There is the refusal to accept the results. Fraud allegations are made, but the lack of evidence presented causes even conservative judges to dismiss any legal proceedings.

Trump then intimates that storming the capital would be OK, and ensures that the military is not there to assist the overwhelmed Capitol Police. These rioters are attempting to FORCE the congress to do what they want, rather than respect the election results.

BOTH SIDES in each of these cases are wrong. Both should be held accountable.

The Left's Hypocrisy is to forget the precedent set by Clinton and the anti-Trump riots of 2016. But this doesn't make storming the capital to force congress at gunpoint to retain Trump as president OK.
Last edited by Navigator on Tue Jan 26, 2021 9:13 pm, edited 1 time in total.

spottybrowncow
Posts: 317
Joined: Fri Jul 24, 2020 11:06 am

Re: Generational Dynamics World View News

Post by spottybrowncow »

Bob Butler wrote:
Tue Jan 26, 2021 5:44 pm
John wrote:
Tue Jan 26, 2021 5:17 pm
Last year, antifa-blm fascists were burning down cities across the country. Kamala Harris and AOC praised these fascist acts as "social justice." This was the exact analogue to the Nazi Kristallnacht.
You regularly attribute the violence last summer to Antifa and Black Lives matter. I think Black Lives Matter are practicing non violence along the pattern set by Gandhi and King. Protest enough and someone figures out that they can win votes by listening. The violence comes from folks like the bad cops, the looters, the Boogaloo Bois, the Proud Boys, QAnon and the secret police. The Wolverine Watchmen are not included only as the cops acted before their plans went into effect. This violence came to a head, became a crisis level problem, with the capitol insurrection.

As long as you maintain this misattribution, this lack of understanding of what is happening, you end up fighting the wrong enemy.

I am more inclined to associate the Nazi Kristallnacht with the capitol riots. Both were attempts by authoritarians to overthrow a legitimate democratic government. The difference was that the capitol insurrection didn’t work.
This article does a good job of explaining the relationship between antifa and blacklivesmatter:

https://amgreatness.com/2020/10/20/the- ... y-at-work/

Navigator
Posts: 901
Joined: Wed Feb 06, 2019 2:15 pm

Re: Generational Dynamics World View News

Post by Navigator »

Very good article. If Trump had won, the violence would have been orders of magnitude worse. These people indeed want to see the end of the Constitution and rule of law. And they have been working towards these ends for quite some time.

If you followed the money, you would find that most of it comes from China. The best way to defeat your enemy is to sow as much dissention as possible into their ranks. The really sad thing is that we enabled this by opening trade with them.

As bad as this is, the vast majority of people, 80-90%, will indeed rally to the flag when we are attacked.

But the hard core "anti-everything the constitution stands for" people will begin an insurrection within the US, attacking the infrastructure and defense work/installations.

Cool Breeze
Posts: 2935
Joined: Sun Jul 26, 2020 10:19 pm

Re: Generational Dynamics World View News

Post by Cool Breeze »

Navigator wrote:
Tue Jan 26, 2021 4:59 pm
Our system is designed to have the courts decide what is unconstitutional or not. Not the individual.
You suggest that I am promoting violence or some such thing. I am not. I am talking about what happens to "a system" which is such a farce that no one could, or should bother caring about it anymore. No more, no less.

To talk about "our system", at such a point, is foolishness. As if we were preserving some "system" and that in itself were noble. It would be an idol at that point. A vile disgusting entity that if it isn't destroyed, soon will crumble.

That's the point.

Cool Breeze
Posts: 2935
Joined: Sun Jul 26, 2020 10:19 pm

Re: Generational Dynamics World View News

Post by Cool Breeze »

John wrote:
Tue Jan 26, 2021 5:17 pm
** 26-Jan-2021 World View: Illegal actions
spottybrowncow wrote:
Tue Jan 26, 2021 5:02 pm
> Not to speak for Navigator, but I think that he understands
> perfectly well. What guards at Nazi death camps did was likely
> legal based on the country's laws at that time, but I don't think
> anyone would now fault someone who disobeyed. Soldiers have a duty
> to disobey "illegal" orders, but that line has, I believe,
> historically been blurry. History would undoubtedly record George
> Washington's army as a bunch of traitors if they had lost. Given
> that the appropriateness of these type actions is often determined
> only in retrospect, drawing lines in the sand in advance probably
> serves no constructive purpose.
Last year, antifa-blm fascists were burning down cities across the
country. Kamala Harris and AOC praised these fascist acts as "social
justice." This was the exact analogue to the Nazi Kristallnacht.

The point I'm making is that I'm challenging both you and Navi in the
sense that in the current evironment, there is no law. If you
criticize media censorship then you're a criminal because, by twisted
reasoning, you're advocating criminal behavior. But if you advocate
censorship, then you're indirectly approving of antifa-blm fascist
violence, which means that you're a hero supporting "social justice,"
not a criminal.

There was a time, not so long ago, when such insanity did not prevail
in America. But it does today. And it's getting progressively worse,
every day, as symbolized by the March of the Penguins.

** 12-Jan-21 World View -- America and the standard Genocide Playbook
** http://www.generationaldynamics.com/pg/ ... tm#e210112
Navi, John supports with this post, my statements above. He is correct - "in the current environment, there is no law"

What a "system," we have, right Navi?

Post Reply

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: Bing [Bot] and 43 guests